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Squad and Force Group Guidance


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Hey Pilots.
 
Johnny (AKA Eringzo) here.
 
I'm new to the game and learning as much as I can. Not only am I new to the CAV, but I am also new to war gaming. I've got a lot to wrap my head around.
 
I'm in Huntsville, TX and hoping to get some traction with some other players locally to get a weekly game going and potentially a slow grow league.
 
After watching some games at CAVCon 2022, I picked up the book along with some mechs. I also purchased some of the 2018 CAVC SO Kickstarter mechs from an individual. I have a couple of each of the following. (In addition to about 10 pounds of scenery from the same purchase. .LOL)
 
Centurion (72285) Templar
Crusader (72286) Templar
Sovereign (72287) Templar
Spartan (72288) Templar
Gladiator II (72299) Templar
Warhawk (72306) Templar
Duelist (72295) Templar
 
Revenant (72289) Malvernis
Butcher (72290) Malvernis
Haunt (72291) Malvernis
Shadow (72292) Malvernis
Obake (72305) Malvernis
Ghost (72293) Malvernis
Pillager (72307) Malvernis
Shade (72297) Malvernis
 
Obviously, there is plenty here to build some Assault and Fire Support Squads. Maybe even a Recon Squad.
 
After reading as much as I can, I know I am still missing some fundamentals on squad building. I'd like to be able to play some games casual enough to interest new players but build my skill set and squads enough to do a bit of tourny play. Maybe 2 squads. I can see that there is a lot more the this than just the Mechs.
 
In order to build some a Primary and Secondary Squad that would help me grow as a player, what would you recommend I be able to bring to the table as far as Infantry and Mechanized Infantry. What about Flight or Mortar?
 
Some examples of some Squads of any of the races would be very helpful.
 
I don't mind spending a few coins on what I need but don't want to just keep guessing when I can use this forum to get help and fill in some of my knowledge gaps.
 
I know that the new core rules are imminent, but I think what has worked for members here in the past will continue to be a viable selection.
 
Sincere thanks in advance for any guidance offered.
 
Johnny
 
Edited by Eringzo
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I started with the Templar models as I know them best. I don't know what next year's CAVCon rules will be but in previous years we often played at 5000 points.

This list uses 6 models you don't have. The Mamba's you can order from Talon Games, the Rapier and the Stilettos you'll need to kit-bash.

This gives you two potent attack squads each with their own Spartan to supply EST or ECM as needed. You want the attack squads to move and shoot while the Spartan's supply the target locks. 

AT001 has your heavy hitters. They are looking to roll crits and smash everything they point their MACs at.

AT002 is a little more finesse. The Duelists allow you to customize their shots to the target in front of them. If it is high armor or hard to hit due to range/cover/double time then you can SALVO fire the light MACs for  a +5 to hit. If the target has armor in the 6 and under range then you'll want to make all 6 attacks fishing for crits and just ripping holes in the smaller targets.

SP001 is really just there to score objectives and harass the foe. Sometime players will shoot at them rather than your valuable stuff and that is a win for you.

RE001 is your Recon squad it doesn't have much in the way of firepower. It should move into positions where it's ECM/APA can impact the fight for your attack squads and stay out of harms way.  They can pick on severely wounded units but honestly earn their money mostly by not firing and manipulating the initiative deck.

 

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Great info here and sincere thanks, James.

I think this is what I needed to get me headed in the right direction. It falls directly in line with some of my reading.  

I still want to get some infantry on the ground and some grav tanks... well, near the ground.

You have been an ongoing source of guiding info. Greatly appreciated. 

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So I play Malvernis as my Primary faction. I own 5. Covid Lockdown was boring.

Revenant (72289) Malvernis (Attack) - The big gun, long range weapons and slow as molasses. Most expensive Malvernis CAV points wise. I use one of him as my commanders CAV.
 
Butcher (72290) Malvernis (Attack) - Good mix of weapons, suffers due to a lack of Ammo Bins as a crit fumble on the MRAC's can lead to the weapons being jammed for rest of the game. The Butcher B variant upgrades the Guided Missiles to a heavier medium mount and splits the Heavy R10 rocket launcher to a pair of Heavy R5 for the cost of an additional 92 points. The model tends to attract a bit of derogatory commentary over the lack of Ammo Bins to counter the MRAC's jamming but I run them because I love the model design and they're painted which is a rarity for me. I run 2 of them with 2 Wights and a Shadow in my Attack Squad.
 
Haunt (72291) Malvernis (Fire Support) - Good movement, lots of indirect (IF) fire launchers, has a Fire Control System that gives a to hit bonus as long as other models in the Squad have one as well Also a Counter Measure system to break target locks, TAGs, or Locked On attempts. I run a pair of them with a pair of shades and a Shadow for my Fire Support squad.
 
Shadow (72292) Malvernis (Recon) - One of our 2 Recon Cav's. Has EST (give its target lock to the rest of its squad automatically.) Active Phase Array 2 (APA if active gives +2 to all direct fire combat rolls and can bypass enemy ECM on an opposed roll) Add one to any Attack squad, particularly if they are packing Guided Missiles) to increase the squads effectiveness.
 
Obake (72305) Malvernis (Attack) - Cruise Missile Platform and one of the few Malvernis models I don't own yet. Works well with a Shadow. Get a target lock from EST, stand back and fire away.
 
Ghost (72293) Malvernis (Attack) - A light Cav it's lightly armed but is cheap and has a WIzzo and Advanced TC 1. Combine that with a target lock (Either its own or from a Shadow using EST) and it'll hit what it's shooting at more often than not. It just might not damage it.
 
Pillager (72307) Malvernis (Attack) - our other big boi. Second most expensive and shorter range than a Revenant due to its Heavy Plasma Bolt Guns. But whatever you hit with those PBG's (especially if Overdriven) will know it's been kissed.  Just watch out for critical fumbles on the overdrive roll as they'll explode and be unusable for the rest of the game.
 
Shade (72297) Malvernis (Fire Support) - A light CAV armed with a pair of small Heavy rocket launchers and a heavy Autocannon. An Advanced Targeting Computer 1 gives a small bonus to hit rolls. I use as a pair with my Haunts and a Shadow in the Fire Support squad to save on points.
 
 
List building.
 
Currently the only models Malvernis has for Recon that exist as a specific model are the Shadow and the Razor. So, if you want to run a squad of Nomads or Stalker vehicles for cheap recon, you'll need to make your own or use proxies. I skipped that part and just added a Recon CAV to my attack and fire support squads. I don't get to move cards in the initiative deck like James does but the squads have ready access to APA, TAG and EST (Shadow) or ECM and EST (Razor).
 
You may have noticed when mentioning my squads, they have 5 models instead of 4. That's because to build a Malvernis Faction list you run 5 models per squad instead of 4. You only have to do this if playing a Faction list. I do it because of gamer OCD and a desire to build a Faction regiment of my own. You do not have to do so and to the best of my knowledge any tournament you may attend will not use the Faction rules anyway. Also, Faction rules are being revamped with the new rules drop (whenever that is happening) so let's build lists to a 4-model standard.
 
I have attached a test force built to 5000 TV points and using basic army composition rules and the assumption you have at least 2 of every model mentioned. The list is 9 models total with an Attack Squad, Fire Support squad and Specialist Squad with a Revenant (Specialist squads can have 1-4 models and is generally the catch-all squad to spend remaining points. But that's my opinion and I could very well be wrong.)
 
1 purchase I highly recommend if you continue to grow Malvernis is the Banshee. essentially a floating Heavy Plasma Blast gun they are quick, nimble and will wreck almost anything when applied in squad force on a single target. However, they are a bit fragile and tend to lose their only armament if you keep overdriving the PBG. But for Flanking, Assassination Runs, Harassment, ECM removal and generally being a pain in the butt to the opposition I don't think we have anything better.
 
On the subject of Infantry, I have not used any yet. However, during my research I've been informed you will need transportation if you want them to get anywhere to do anything of use during the game (they slow.) or to buy them the ODST upgrade (if you use upgrades in your game) so they can do a HALO drop into position (or somewhere nearby where they're supposed to be). I am adding Infantry to my Army and using stolen I mean "repurposed" Ritterlich Armadillo transports to act as Malvernis Raider transports as I like the look and they're tracked like a Raider. 1 Raider will carry 4 Light or Heavy Infantry bases or 2 Power Armor bases.
 
Hopefully this was helpful and not boring.
 
Jim
 
 

Test force.pdf

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Loving the guidance here. All of it is valuable. And Jim, your post was the opposite of boring. It was engaging and on point.

I am surprised more the use of infantries doesn’t come into play in casual games.

2 follow up questions.

#1 Where can I find more info or Data Cards for the different infantry? I found that I could possibly generate them from the CAV Force Manager. Are there Pre-generated ones that I am just not finding?

#2 On the Stiletto and Rapier, I can find:

MODEL NAME                 TYPE                    MOVE                 ROLE                   FACTION             DT                        TVP                      VARIANT

RAPIER                              CAV                     BIPEDAL              RECON                TEMPLAR            6                           345                      NA

STILETTO                          VEHICLE              WHEELED           ATTACK               TEMPLAR            3                           71                        NA

I can generate some Data Cards from the CAV Force Manager. (Jon W. stated that it was still roughly 80% accurate. Here’s to hoping the web-based version comes soon!) Has anyone posted what they feel these kit bashes would look like or is open to interpretation based on MOVE and WEAPONS? (i.e. (Rapier= Walker with 4 racks of GM) and (Stiletto=Roller with 1 Mounted MAC)?

 Same question for the Nomads or Stalkers that Krugerannd mentioned. I like the idea of kit bashing and would like to see what has been done by others.

Looking forward to meeting everyone at some of the Reaper Saturday/Sunday meets. I will absolutely be attending several times a year.

Johnny

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18 minutes ago, Eringzo said:

Loving the guidance here. All of it is valuable. And Jim, your post was the opposite of boring. It was engaging and on point.

I am surprised more the use of infantries doesn’t come into play in casual games.

2 follow up questions.

#1 Where can I find more info or Data Cards for the different infantry? I found that I could possibly generate them from the CAV Force Manager. Are there Pre-generated ones that I am just not finding?

#2 On the Stiletto and Rapier, I can find:

MODEL NAME                 TYPE                    MOVE                 ROLE                   FACTION             DT                        TVP                      VARIANT

RAPIER                              CAV                     BIPEDAL              RECON                TEMPLAR            6                           345                      NA

STILETTO                          VEHICLE              WHEELED           ATTACK               TEMPLAR            3                           71                        NA

I can generate some Data Cards from the CAV Force Manager. (Jon W. stated that it was still roughly 80% accurate. Here’s to hoping the web-based version comes soon!) Has anyone posted what they feel these kit bashes would look like or is open to interpretation based on MOVE and WEAPONS? (i.e. (Rapier= Walker with 4 racks of GM) and (Stiletto=Roller with 1 Mounted MAC)?

 Same question for the Nomads or Stalkers that Krugerannd mentioned. I like the idea of kit bashing and would like to see what has been done by others.

Looking forward to meeting everyone at some of the Reaper Saturday/Sunday meets. I will absolutely be attending several times a year.

Johnny

Infantry got ignored in the beginning because what's the poster child for the game? The CAV. I want robots and I want all the robots. Big, small, tall, short, thin, fat, nimble, sluggish, heavily armed, lightly packing, able to make a pinpoint strike or just going to waddle over and sit on the enemy's house, we don't care we want the robots. Then you find out CAV's cost a bit TV pointwise, and you realize tanks are good too. And aircraft. And infantry can sue up that last 400 points you can't buy a squad with and then you're 4 orders into Talon Games and the credit card company would like a word with you.

 

#1. Data card pdf's can be found here CAV: STRIKE OPERATIONS Downloads (talon-games.com) All the infantry data cards are under OPEN as all Factions share the same stats/models for Infantry. Also listed are Datacard pdfs for all Factions and documents listing all a faction's models type and points cost. May I also recommend a copy of the Cheat Sheets. The Special Ability one is almost Mandatory.

#2. As far as kit-bashing or proxies go it's open season. Some make their own CAV's out of existing ones, some use models and other parts from other games. Some just buy things similar to what they want and say, "This is model x. Learn it, Love it, Live it." CAV is 10mm or N-Scale so as long as it is roughly the right size and can be easily identified it shouldn't be a problem. If you have access to 3-d printing Thingiverse can be a source of a mess of parts and vehicles.

The last game I played my Recon squad of Nomad's were played by the Templar 99th Regiments' Mamba recon squad. We thank them for their service.

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Understood and you are correct. CAVs are obviously the focus. But I do appreciate the fact that there are layers to the game and you can dive as deep as you want to. 

With your help, I found the Data Cards. Many thanks. I just glossed over 'OPEN' multiple times. 

And you could say that I am a bit of a fan of 3D printing. Attached is a pic of the set up at my old house and the shop that I am building to set up more printers and my gaming tables and adult beverage bar. 

Many sincere thanks for your time and help. 

Respectfully, 

Eringzo

20210327_164526.jpg

 

20220911_110911.jpg

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12 hours ago, Krugerannd said:

1 purchase I highly recommend if you continue to grow Malvernis is the Banshee. essentially a floating Heavy Plasma Blast gun they are quick, nimble and will wreck almost anything when applied in squad force on a single target. However, they are a bit fragile and tend to lose their only armament if you keep overdriving the PBG. But for Flanking, Assassination Runs, Harassment, ECM removal and generally being a pain in the butt to the opposition I don't think we have anything better.

 
 

Test force.pdf 42.2 kB · 1 download

Also, Banshees might be the best looking models in the game. 🙂

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